Today’s Q&A is sponsored by Kyrö – get 10% off all their spirits with code FORGOTTENGIN10 at:
https://www.kyrodistillery.com
0:02:41 – Could the US scale up small arms production to wartime mass levels?
0:08:57 – How were wood gunstocks made?
0:13:36 – Barrel attachment; alternatives to threading?
0:15:50 – Decline in gunsmiths and gunsmithing
0:20:34 – What would emergency small arms look like today?
Video – “Last Ditch” M16: https://youtu.be/1SDL4n8yUe8
Video – Croatian Crogar M91: https://youtu.be/Ruif6Qym3zw
Video – Croatian Vila Velabita: https://youtu.be/vLOwArnKWV8
Video – Croatian Sokac: https://youtu.be/d82b4xb6bAA
0:23:36 – Lost manufacturing methods
0:25:19 – Metallurgy and alloys in gunmaking
0:29:31 – Manufacturing tolerances
0:41:54 – Simplification of designs
0:44:18 – Why don’t we have stamped guns today?
0:46:49 – Venezuelan AK-100s in the US?
0:48:58 – Home-scale metal 3D printers?
0:50:43 – 3D printing applications besides suppressors?
0:54:17 – AI and 3D printing for reproduction guns?
0:56:46 – Books about the gunmaking business
0:57:37 – What if Stoner didn’t get into guns?
0:59:37 – Ammunition production quality
1:05:46 – Do I have my own gun design I want to make?
1:06:46 – Historical metallurgy in gun manufacture
Book – “Fighting Iron”: https://amzn.to/3Z89Fsk
1:09:04 – Why are magazines so hard to make?
1:14:47 – Advice for new reproduction gunmakers
1:19:47 – Pros and cons of different manufacturing methods
‘Why are magazines hard to make?’ During the Malayan Emergency in 1948, American tin miners asked the Malayan Police if they could lend them guns to protect themselves, as the mines were in remote locations. The Police said they had hundreds of M1 Carbines but, due to a logistical error, they only had one magazine! The chief engineer asked for the magazine and said they would swap 10 machine shop-made magazines for 1 carbine. This was done and not only did the miners prevent any further attacks on the mines, they also supplied the Malayan Police with magazines to equip their personnel. Any M1 Carbines seen in period photos are equipped with ‘home made’ magazines, which apparently worked well.
“what if Eugene Stoner back in the 50 had
stay back in the 50s had stayed in the
aircraft parts design business and never
got never desired to design firearms?”
According to https://guns.fandom.com/wiki/ArmaLite
ArmaLite was founded by Charles Dorchester and George Sullivan in the early 1950s as a private venture, but did not establish itself as a company proper until late 1954, when Sullivan convinced Richard Boutelle, president of the Fairchild Engine and Airplane Corporation, to invest in ArmaLite. Consequently ArmaLite became a subsidiary of Fairchild. Eugene Stoner was appointed as ArmaLite’s first chief designer.
Dorchester & Sullivan’s original business model was to produce low-cost, lightweight rifles that made extensive use of plastic and fibreglass…
Therefore one might suspect that ArmaLite would be making fire-arms from said materials, even if they would appoint not-Stoner, as Dorchester and Sullivan were pushing said idea.
Yeah. The idea behind Armalite was to make weapons out of aeronautic materials. That was not an idea of Stoner. He was the guy hired to realize it.
And at that time, the idea was in the air. Between the late ’40s and early ’50s, a lot of aluminium-framed handguns appeared. The AR10 had not even been the first self-loading, mass-produced, aluminium framed, long weapon. The Franchi 48AL shotgun, IE, arrived first (and, with 28″ barrel and wooden furniture, it was even lighter than the AR10).
Ky Ro product placement…
eeeeee…
But I really do not object – to the contrary!
Let’s drink!
To the Finns!
To our Allies!
(they did trash both the Russki and the Germans, when time came; I am glad these tough boys & girls are now with us, in NATO)
2nd Lieutenant turpin, who managed to swap the Warsaw Pact for NATO
With you as long as it is in their perceived interest to be with you. Those who change sides once will do so again. That is not criticism, just realism. It is like being in a bar. The nice lady is your friend as long as you can buy her drinks. So too your esteemed allies
On the subject of tolerances … specifically ammunition tolerances… a good example is the Canadian-made Ross rifle which was accurate enough for snipers, but was too precise for the ammunition coming out of British factories circa April 1915. As the war dragged on, tools wore out and sloppier ammo left British factories. That sloppy, over-diameter ammo jammed in precise Ross actions. IOW Most of the poor decisions about Ross Rifles were made in Britain.
Britain being under significant pressure mind, at the time; definately had to knock rifles out – Due to rifles and those holding them, suddenly… Disintegrating into smaller parts under heavy German shelling. Troublesome issue.
Many “good designs” have failed due to the inability to keep the tight tolerances required by the design during mass production.
It’s up to the manufacturer, not the designer. A lot of parts don’t pass QC at reception and are then not paid.
Many thanks.
All engineering decisions are a matter of balancing trade offs between perfect and good enough. Most folks don’t understand that. You do a great job of expressing that in layman’s terms.
I had a co-worker whose favorite mantra was “perfect is the enemy of the good”.
It is not just laymen who don’t get the requirement of a design being “good enough”, when it comes time for mass production. Designers can get so enraptured with the utter brilliance of their “perfect” design that they also lose track of whether it can be mass produced properly or if the design has such tight tolerances that hand building prototypes is all that can be achieved.
Although Ian’s fluency and expression of detail was not affected, (possibly because his gin was diluted), appearing in a video, handling firearms while drinking alcohol in the UK will result in a visit by the local Constabulary, who will revoke your Firearms License and seize anything that looks like a gun. The Bill of Rights has long been forgotten here.
It must be so difficult to live in a country where being a drunken asswipe has repercussions.
It must be nice living in a country where complaining about one’s government importing indigent violent foreigners lands one in gaol, eh wot?
At least we don’t get shot dead for complaining about one’s government forcibly exporting foreigners. Or, as in Iran, just for complaining.
Ian,
Great article. As an engineer that does not design guns, you were echoing many of my thoughts in product design. A couple of points. When you design a part, if you know what the capabilities of the machine that will produce it, then is very easy to design the part so that 99% will pass quality checks. Many Americans still think of tolerancing in the dimensional or linear style. Most of the world has moved on the geometric (GD&T) (form, orientation, location, run-out). These ensure parts function correctly, ensuring proper assembly and interchangeability. Using GD&T, solid model CAD with AI one engineer can now design an assembly in much less time, and ensure that the first production run works correctly. These new techniques cut years off development time with far fewer engineers.
What you say about “cut years off development time” is only true if the CAD gurus know what the loads are that a given part has to withstand. This is in my view the real problem in firearms design. Finding people who not only have CAD knowledge at their fingertips, but also the consequences of the usually pulsating loads encountered in firearms.
There is a reason why the German MG5, praised for it light weight, ended up as a totally different design (receiver, recoil spring arragement) that is actually heavier that the MG3 it was intended to replace.
You would be very suprised as the complexity of some of the CAD systems and their sumulation capabilities. Look at F1 car design and how they utilize CAD, AI and complex simulation software to design upgrades very rapidly. Most engineered design work is preformed by the Engineer using CAD, who can input all the expeced loading. I am 60 years old, and I studied to be a draftsman in the early 80s. The whole Drafting industry evaporated when CAD came out. Now with CAD using AI there are going to be a lot of Solid Works CAD gurus out of work. We will also see new products drasticly cut deveolopment. I was designine plastic injection molded parts. Not so long ago after I finished a design it could take 9 to 12 months before I would see a sample. Now I can get and actual molded part in less than three weeks. Mainly due to simulation software and AI. Manufacturing and produce design is changing at a very rapid pace.
That an infantry 7.62 NATO MG designed in this century weights more than 10kg is something that cries for vengeance.
therein is a good example of narcissistic sadism and gaslighting
subjecting someone to an indignity but trying to forbid them from ever saying what it really is.
as a follow-up
look at the political disappearance of Handgunner magazine for having published an article describing some of the many shortcomings of the L85 rifle and LSW.
A note on firearm repair:
When you factor in the cost of replacement parts and labor; most guns, from the cheap Turkish import junk to the store brand sporting guns of the 60s, are not worth the cost of doing any major repair to.
Old .22 rifles are the best example of this.
Leads to a lot of bent feelings at the gun counter.
This is just WAAAAY TOOOO LOOOONG.
My answer on last ditch modern US guns is the same as it was last time it was asked in Q&A: Look at the AR15s made to get in before the AWB. Those things have some weird and whacky shortcuts to get as many out before the deadline.